Self Sustaining Gardening

[SoyBean]

I live in a 2bdr townhome with a very small backyard. So I would like to grow vegetables in pots if at all possible. I have tried growing things in the past but I seem to have a black thumb. Herbs die on me. I started some a few months back indoors and they sprouted. Great sprouts but after achieving their first leaves they began to wilt and die off. It seemed like they were growing tall and they could not support their own height. So they wilted over and died.

Right now I am attempting corn. Just on a whim decided to try sweet corn. Eventually I will put this outside, but for now they are in an egg carton. I achieve great humidity and temps inside are always above 68. The packet of corn said they would sprout in 7-14 days I think. It hasn't been a week yet but I check every day for sprouts.

Any advice would be great. I eventually want to grow all my own vegetables and things like that. I like the idea of being self sustaining, and I'm even venturing into composting. All I need is somewhere to put it.

 

[OaklandCityFarmer]

Hi SoyBean.

We have 2 properties and we live in the Bay Area for most of the year. Here we have a very small backyard that we have transformed into a garden for our own fruits and veggies.

If you're going to plant stuff in pots then there are some things to remember. Make sure the pots you use are big enough to support the amount of plants that you are wanting to put in. Moisture retention can also be tricky. Most pots also heat up quicker because they're made of plastic and dark colored, if at all possible use light colored ones. Selecting dwarf and early varieties also helps since they usually require less space and they tolerate a short growing season (which is important if you don't have the room outside to keep pots). There is a lot of information about container gardening online and plenty of books out there.

We actually make "wine barrel" gardens for people in our area that have a variety of veggies in them. They seem to do well and our customers come back every year. We can provide a lot more info on this if you'd like.

Starting seeds indoors can sometimes be tricky. If they are becoming thin and leggy then they might be overwatered or just not have enough light. An light that hangs over the seeds is the best. Using a good and fresh seed starting medium is very important too.

If you want to plant outdoors, start by testing your soil and seeing what it needs first. Add appropriate amendments and nutrients as needed. Depending on your part of the country, you'd have to do this pretty quickly to get a good harvest this year.

After that, you could save a lot of space using a variety of intensive gardening ideas. Most plants don't need to be as close as suggested. We plant carrots between rows of tomatoes. Cucumbers, peas and beans grow up our corn stalks. Other vines grow up fences and trellises.

There is too much to go over here but with plenty of research you could easily on your way. Remember gardening isn't that hard as it seems and should be relaxing and enjoyable so be patient and let it happen.

 

[SoyBean]

Well I got curious and decided to check on the corn. I uncovered one of the corn "seeds" and sure enough, there was a little sprout on its way up to the surface. I then checked another and it has a nice root growing.

I'm worried though that the egg carton will be too small for them after they sprout. Will it be ok to move them to a larger "pot". I plan on using used plastic cups (I want to recycle as much as I can).

 

[OaklandCityFarmer]

Carefully cut the egg carton without disturbing the roots, corn does not take well to transplanting.

If you can, transplant it into it's permanent location instead of having to move it to a bigger pot each time. If you do plan on growing the corn in a pot make sure you plant at least 4 in a block space about 6 inches apart. This will help with proper pollination.

Also, be patient. Some seeds can take as long as 3 weeks to sprout. Provide them water, warmth and ventilation and they'll be okay.

 

[SoyBean]

Thanks for the information about transplanting them. If growing them in a container, what size should it be?

We also plan on growing carrots and cucumbers. If we succeed at growing these this year, we will attempt others next year. We have not planted the cucumber seeds or the carrot seeds yet. Are those ok with transplanting (can we start them in the egg carton?) or would they be best with being planted in a permanent spot?

We like to recycle and reuse as much as possible. (for example, the egg carton.) I took the idea of a seed starter box which was basically a plastic tray with spaces for the soil and seeds and a plastic cover to keep in humidity and made my own with an egg carton and ziplock bags. So far its working so I'm going to see if I can get seeds to sprout with this method. The last time I tried growing seeds I forgot they like humidity and they died off rather fast.

 

[Backyard Buddies]

Oakland has given you some great advice and I don't have much to add to it, except that an option is that when you transplant the corn, first cut each of the individual egg cups apart, then get the bottom good and wet and *carefully* cut it off. This would be similar to the directions you'd use with peat pots. Then, simply plant the little egg cup, sans bottom, and you'll do the least amount of disturbing of the corn plant.

 

[OaklandCityFarmer]

Thanks for the information about transplanting them. If growing them in a container, what size should it be?

If planting just the corn, should be about a 12"x12" square for a minimum of 4 corn plants. You could even plant about 2-3 cucumbers between the corn and train them up. Wait until the corn is about a foot tall before starting the cucumbers or they will take over too fast. If you plant the cucumber as well I'd increase the pot size by a few inches.

We provide an 18"x18" planter box that fits 4 corn plants, 2 cucumbers, 8 radishes and 8 carrots. That's a great harvest from a small box.

We also plan on growing carrots and cucumbers. If we succeed at growing these this year, we will attempt others next year. We have not planted the cucumber seeds or the carrot seeds yet. Are those ok with transplanting (can we start them in the egg carton?) or would they be best with being planted in a permanent spot?

Cucumber can be started like that with no problem. Carrots should not be transplanted because that can cause forked roots. A long plant box from any garden center should be able to provide you with a good carrot harvest. If you get it extra wide then plant some tomato plants in the back and carrots in the front. They benefit from each other. The box would have to be about 3 feet long, at least 18 inches wide and about 12-16 inches deep.

We like to recycle and reuse as much as possible. (for example, the egg carton.) I took the idea of a seed starter box which was basically a plastic tray with spaces for the soil and seeds and a plastic cover to keep in humidity and made my own with an egg carton and ziplock bags. So far its working so I'm going to see if I can get seeds to sprout with this method. The last time I tried growing seeds I forgot they like humidity and they died off rather fast.

That's a great setup. We have a tool that makes pots out of newspaper. We got it from Botanical Gardens and save us a lot of money. They do need humidity but do not let it exceed about 85% after they have sprouted. The need proper ventilation and humidity. As they grow, slowly decrease the amount of humidity by raising the plastic above them. Excessive humidity could lead to the seedlings rotting.

 

[SoyBean]

I put a hydrometer in there the other day to measure the humidity and after a good water and putting it in the sun, the humidity reaches around 73-75%. Humidity in the house is around 40%, sometimes going up to 50%.

We will go to the garden store tomorrow to look for the plant box as well as some tomato seeds. I love fresh tomato on a sandwich.

Thanks for all the help. Hopefully with the right information and some dedicated work, I can turn my black thumb green.

 

[patandchickens]

Your earlier problems with your herb seeds (which are likely to bne repeated unless you change your setup) sound to me like either insufficient light, or damping-off.

Lightwise, if the windowsill is not in direct sunlight for about 6-8 hrs a day AND quite bright the rest of the time, it is not a good place to start seeds -- you'd be amazed how much light a seedling needs and how relatively UNbright even an apparently "bright" window is when the sun is not actually shining through it. Pulling thin gauzy white curtains behind the plant (on the room side), or taping paper towels to the window so the plant's between them and the glass (in warm weather only) can help some. But really, to start HEALTHY seedlings indoors, you ought to have fluorescent lights that you can lower so that they are, no kidding!, only about 2" above the seedlings' top leaves. Two inches. Raise them as the plants grow.

Damping-off is a fungal disease that causes young seedlings to suddenly wilt in the middle of the stem and topple over and die. The commonest cause is too much humidity and too little air circulation. You can't grow healthy seedlings in a closed 'mini-greenhouse' environment. If you have a lid or bag for humidity because your house air is really really dry, it still has to be open a significant amount of the way, so that air can circulate. Occasionally people get damping-off because of reusing filthy flats/pots or because of using soil/compost from the ground outdoors, but the vast majority of cases are from insufficient air movement.

Good luck with your corn! Transplant carefully. Tomatoes might be good to try -- they are pretty easy to start from seed, *like* being transplanted , and make a satisfying crop from a container. If you start them now you will be a wee bit behind some other people but there is still PLENTY of time for seeds started now to grow up and produce a good crop of ripe tomatoes for you

Have fun,

Pat

 

[SoyBean]

Thanks for the advice. I have a few old fish tank lights that I'm not using anymore. I believe the lights are florescent. Would these work? I can get the wattage if that matters. I could possibly rig up either of these lights to sit 2" from the seedlings.