2019 Little Easy Bean Network - Come And Reawaken The Thrill Of Discovery

[Blue-Jay]

2018

I have grown Sweetwater for 4 seasons without it showing any tendency to grow runners. However last year in 2018 I did have a bean that was a semi runner growing probably about 15 feet away. It was a Robert Lobitz bean called Red Spotted Delight. I believe if a true bush crosses with a semi runner that runner characteristic will show up in the next year in the F1. Will have to see what the seed coat looks like when you get dry seed from it. Changes in the seed coat will not be seen until I believe the second grow out. If you get a new seed coat then a cross occured two seasons of grow out previously. However and I think you will get the same Sweetwater looking seeds from your plants that have grown runners. If you do get the same Sweetwater looks seeds. Then I'm pretty sure that the male pollen donor was Red Spotted Delight in 2018.

 

[flowerbug]

a lot of flowers out there! *whee!* and so far no JB's!

 

[BeanQueen]

I have grown Sweetwater for 4 seasons without it showing any tendency to grow runners. However last year in 2018 I did have a bean that was a semi runner growing probably about 15 feet away. It was a Robert Lobitz bean called Red Spotted Delight. I believe if a true bush crosses with a semi runner that runner characteristic will show up in the next year in the F1. Will have to see what the seed coat looks like when you get dry seed from it. Changes in the seed coat will not be seen until I believe the second grow out. If you get a new seed coat then a cross occured two seasons of grow out previously. However and I think you will get the same Sweetwater looking seeds from your plants that have grown runners. If you do get the same Sweetwater looks seeds. Then I'm pretty sure that the male pollen donor was Red Spotted Delight in 2018.

No, you see the seed coat when F1 is harvested (F2).
Mother bean+ pollen= mother bean seed coat (F1) and new growth habit
F1 + self pollination= new seed coat (F2) and F1s growth habit (if already stable)

Your beans crossed and gave you F1, which I planted. I ame sthe new growth habit of the cross and this harvest will be F2 where you see the new seed coat

 

[Blue-Jay]

No, you see the seed coat when F1 is harvested (F2).
Mother bean+ pollen= mother bean seed coat (F1) and new growth habit
F1 + self pollination= new seed coat (F2) and F1s growth habit (if already stable)

Your beans crossed and gave you F1, which I planted. I ame sthe new growth habit of the cross and this harvest will be F2 where you see the new seed coat

Basically I said the same thing. I couldn't believe it crossed with a semi runner further in the past because I should have seen this trait before but didn't. You should get the same seed coat as Sweetwater because it would take two seasons to see a new seed coat. Maternally passed on characteristics in bean take two seasons to express themselves. That's always been my understanding. The next grow out of this semi runner will give you the new seed coat F3. So I was sure that the cross had to happen last year and Red Spotted Delight is probably likely the pollen donor. I got the Sweetwater seed coat last year and it should be Sweetwater seed coat one more time this season. This grow out is the first season next year would be the second season and the new seed coat. Let's see if it happens that way. I think it will.

 

[Michael Lusk]

Basically I said the same thing. I couldn't believe it crossed with a semi runner further in the past because I should have seen this trait before but didn't. You should get the same seed coat as Sweetwater because it would take two seasons to see a new seed coat. The next grow out of this semi runner will give you the new seed coat. So I was sure that the cross had to happen last year and Red Spotted Delight is probably likely the pollen donor. I got the Sweetwater seed coat last year and it should be Sweetwater seed coat one more time this season. This grow out is the first season next year would be the second season and the new seed coat. Let's see if it happens that way. I think it will.

Interesting discussion. I'm a bit of a novice with this and just so I'm following correctly, does the "F" in your discussions simply represent the next generation / planting? Also, would conditions ever play into growth habit or is it always dictated by genetics?

 

[PhilaGardener]

Yes, P is for Parental generation, F1 is the first Filial (son or daughter) generation, F2 is the second Filial generation ("grand children") and so on.

The interplay between genetics and the environment can be complex. A good example is that under some conditions a semi-runner variety will grow as a bush, and for another gardener (or in a different year) the plants may reach for the sky.

 

[BeanQueen]

Basically I said the same thing. I couldn't believe it crossed with a semi runner further in the past because I should have seen this trait before but didn't. You should get the same seed coat as Sweetwater because it would take two seasons to see a new seed coat. Maternally passed on characteristics in bean take two seasons to express themselves. That's always been my understanding. The next grow out of this semi runner will give you the new seed coat F3. So I was sure that the cross had to happen last year and Red Spotted Delight is probably likely the pollen donor. I got the Sweetwater seed coat last year and it should be Sweetwater seed coat one more time this season. This grow out is the first season next year would be the second season and the new seed coat. Let's see if it happens that way. I think it will.

I'm a visual person and this is making my head spin. The new seed coat will be in this fall's harvest. I'm pretty excited, I can't wait to see it!

 

[BeanQueen]

Also, would conditions ever play into growth habit or is it always dictated by genetics?

Bluejay77 and I were just discussing this yesterday because I have a problem in my garden where some varieties constantly grow runners as bush, and some semi-runners grow more like half runners

 

[Ridgerunner]

I'm a visual person and this is making my head spin. The new seed coat will be in this fall's harvest. I'm pretty excited, I can't wait to see it!

A few years back I go four different cross-pollinated bend from Russ, several beans of each cross-pollination. I wound up with 25 different seeds coats, none of them like the bean I planted. Some that were supposed to be bush were pole, some poles were bush. Don't expect one seed coat, you could have many. You are going to have fun!!!

 

[BeanQueen]

A few years back I go four different cross-pollinated bend from Russ, several beans of each cross-pollination. I wound up with 25 different seeds coats, none of them like the bean I planted. Some that were supposed to be bush were pole, some poles were bush. Don't expect one seed coat, you could have many. You are going to have fun!!!

All beans from one plant will be the same. You don't get different beans on different branches. But the three plants might be all different. And then the next year's grow outs if they're unstable or crossed again, but I am blossom bagging them so they shouldn't be crossed again