Got 3 Berries Today!

[bj taylor]

growing up in southwest Oregon the berries were everywhere. marshall you are a lucky guy

 

[897tgigvib]

I kind of think that the Indian Summer and the Ursinus are going to spread like crazy! Indian Summer has about a dozen sprouts coming up as far as 4 feet from the main plant! Ursinus has about 5 as far as 4 feet from it's main plant.

I will need to keep them contained to that north bed.

 

[digitS']

Of Rubus:

Fall Gold ER
Indian Summer ER
Black Satin BB
Burbank TBB
Local native salmon/dew berry, unknown, can't discover species
Local Ursinus BB
Boysenberry hybrid berry HB
Lacianatus species BB
Arapaho BB
Marionberry HB
Navajo TBB
Loganberry HB
Dewberry species BB
Tayberry HB

I think that's 14

ER = everbearing raspberry
BB = Blackberry
TBB = thornless blackberry
HB = hybrid berry, usually of some kind of blackberry with some kind of raspberry

edited to add the tayberry because i forgot it...

Look at all the hybrids! And, these are inter-species hybrids not just crossing cultivar lines.

growing up in southwest Oregon the berries were everywhere. marshall you are a lucky guy

I didn't know that was where you were from, BJ!

I grew up in the Medford area. Yes, in Gold Hill, we pulled blackberry and wild rose bushes out of our upper pasture with the tractor & a chain. I was the choker-setter.


Now, I allow room for a few raspberries beside the rhubarb and do battle with the neighbors' raspberries in the gardens.

Steve

 

[897tgigvib]

Digit, by actual biological definition, that is the one that goes approximately:

IF THEY CAN BREED AND EXCHANGE GENE POOLS THEN THEY ARE THE SAME BIOLOGICAL SPECIES:

Then the Rubus genus is actually a single biological species.

However, Rubus is by convention sorted into separate species based on WHERE their wild ancestor is from, AND, based on VISIBLE MORPHOLOGICAL TRAITS.

Those who strongly adhere to the BIOLOGICAL DEFINITION OF SPECIES would go so far as to say that sorting a single biological species into separated pseudospecies based on morphology or spatial separation is a fetish.

I'm not one to go that far. But I do feel that folks should at least understand that some so called GENERA, Rubus in this case, are actually species. The Rose clade is another example: Wild Roses from Siberia happily and easily cross with wild Roses from anywhere else. All wild roses from anywhere readily cross with wild roses from anywhere else, yet they are each given a separate species name. Same is true in a different way with Brassicas, and lots and lots of so called Genera.

=====

I think it's ok. I kind of like the convention, but just wish there could be a good word for the group. Something better than SUBSPECIES, which is the real word. Nobody seems to like subspecies. Meantime, it's alright.

And the hybrid berries? Yes! I seriously enjoy that subtle raspberry flavor, and I seriously enjoy the strong blackberry flavor, and the way crossing them seems to make bigger berries...I like

I'd kind of like to do some crossing my own self of them!

 

[joz]

I grew up in Eugene, OR, and my grandparents (the ones with the original Thompson's Seedless grapes ) would summer in Winchester Bay.
On days we weren't fishing (or crabbing, or digging clams), we might go berry picking.

Or, when I was at home, I'd go out back and pick from / hack away at the huge blackberry canes/vines/hedges/kudzu that had taken over my parents' backyard. We had one wee boysenberry patch that was crowded, heavily, by the no-name "wild" berries everywhere else. I think they even took over the rhubarb.

When I went away to college, I had no idea that the food culture my family raised me with wasn't the norm. It never occurred to me to compare fridge/pantry contents with my friends. So much of the food I took for granted I missed something fierce when I came down south.

I bought a thornless blackberry (Apache?) for my container garden, a few years ago. Planted it, babied it, was so excited when it bloomed... watched eagerly for the berries, and waited... waited... waited... for the fattest juiciest ripest one before FINALLY eating it.....

And it was terrible.

Bitter, dusty, huge seeds, bleh.

So, now that I own a house and have a bit of a backyard, I'm eyeballing some tissue-cultured Marionberries. They come in 9-packs. How far apart does one plant such things?

 

[digitS']

And, there is another displaced Oregonian!

Like to do your own crossing, Marshall? That shouldn't surprise any of us .

What about growing them is close proximity? Forget the cross-pollination for a moment. What about competition.

One reason I have raspberries encroaching in both big & little veggie gardens is from competition. In the big veggie garden, it is competition from grapes. Okay fine, they are trying to escape to greener pastures. but in the little veggie garden it seems to be competition from the neighbors blackberries.

Now the blackberries don't do well here as a wild "subspecies." They barely survive and seldom produce anything more than a taste for the birds. I used to think that meant the cultivated varieties wouldn't amount to much either. Well, they may and they may not.

I noticed that the neighbor's blackberries nearly died out a couple of winters ago. They must not handle sub-zero very well. But . . . anyway, once they get wound up they seem to take over space from the raspberries! The raspberries do fine handling everything the local environment throws at them except - competition. Dang blackberries struggle and then push; the poor raspberries get crowded out of the way. At least, it seems to me.

Steve

 

[897tgigvib]

Yep, I am fully expecting to have to do a LOT of cutting on those that want to rule the world, and urging some of the others along. Loganberry looks like the most behaved and strong. I see a few sprouts less than a foot from it's main base. Boysen looks like it'll hold its own too if I keep it tied up and in above the others. Indian Summer will be getting a whole lot of chopping WHEN it gets past the 4 foot bounds I'm giving it. Looks like Dew will be good on the end, and not sure how Fall Gold will be on the other end with Indian Summer near it. Will cut I.S. back anywhere near it. I'll stake Tay up. Ursinus will be getting lots of cutting, Burbank is tied high, wants to go through the netting. Don't know how Navajo will be. I'll figure as I go...

May need some new Felcos just for the berries!

 

[bj taylor]

I looked today and I have three blossoms on one blackberry vine out back. that's the extent of my berry experience here. maybe someday, God willing, I will live in a kinder climate.

 

[897tgigvib]

There has to be a berry for Texas!!! One what likes it hot n dry

I'm guessing there is!