Grapes- Wild and Otherwise

[Jared77]

From my understanding there is some rot but there is still a good portion of the grapes still useable. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ice_wine covers it pretty well. We are regulars to Old Mission Peninsula here in Michigan and some of the wineries here in Michigan do make ice wine. There are a number of wineries up there and we have a lot of great local wines available.

I first found out and experienced ice wine from friends of ours who brought some for an after dinner treat. I've never tried to make it myself, but its one of the things I'd like to try my hand at.

 

[Durgan]

My limited experience with ice wine is that it is disgusting and expensive.

I enjoy pure grape juice. Concord is particularly good as are other dark grapes. Elderberry is also excellent. From where I sit wine is destruction of good grape juice, but to each his own.

Typical preserving method.

http://www.durgan.org/URL/?TPVRN 26 August 2012 Elderberry Juice
This year about 30 pounds of elderberries have been picked and processed into juice.About two pounds of berries make one litre of juice.The berries are not as prolific this year due to a long drought. To date 14 litres have been pressure canned. Annotated pictures depict the process.

 

[Jared77]

From where I sit negative opinions are best kept to one's self. But then to each their own.

 

[Durgan]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...-reveals-unpalatable-truth-wine-industry.html

The truth is the whole wine business is a con - and the only victim is you, the great, wine-drinking, myth-swallowing, duty-paying public.

About 30 or so years ago Italy sold 25 million gallons of table wine to France over a four year period, delivered in tanker trucks and bottled in France. The French loved it. Eventually it came out that the product was simply a collection of chemicals mixed together and no grapes were used in the process. When Italy was taken to task the response was tough the French are supposed to be the connoisseurs.

 

[Iona's Orchard]

Thank you for all your replies and help! To answer some questions and give more info, our soil is a rocky clay that plants grow surprisingly well in. For a support (terrace?), I was planning on the traditional four corners with beams running in between. I don't remember the grape type, I'll check, but is there a grape that would thrive in our soil type? How about pruning? And my biggest concern with digging up the invasive thorns and grapes was damaging the intended grape's roots. Problem? And some general grape care info would be appreciated!

 

[897tgigvib]

So much is talked about the different qualities of wines from different varieties, subtle "finishes", various names to the "exquisite rising draws to the palate", and other advanced descriptions that poor plebians will never understand. However, a good friend's family grows grapes and makes wines for sharing and for the wine shows where they often beat the big producers. All the words I use to describe aren't the fancy accepted words when they give to me, as a gift!, a bottle of deep Zinfandel that would cost 300 dollars if it was ever to be sold. Words come from me like, Oh wow, this wine tastes like it is still alive! or, I can taste the juice still in it!

But, why is no such splendor give to grape juices of different vintage, grow locale, varieties, or blends and marriages? I truly am encouraging a major wine producer family, a different one, to begin experimenting in juices. Perhaps their young daughter who has yet to have her very own first row of grapes, might want to begin a line of "Petit Syrah 2019 Juice" for example. Maybe she'll also have, "Pinot Noir #514 2021 Juice" to be compared with "Pinot Noir #2197 2021 Juice", and maybe even suggested food pairings such as roasted summer scallops and balsam vinegar over bib lettuce.

Luther Burbank did once say that if he ever produced a wine grape by accident, he would destroy it.

 

[Jared77]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ustry.html

The truth is the whole wine business is a con - and the only victim is you, the great, wine-drinking, myth-swallowing, duty-paying public.

About 30 or so years ago Italy sold 25 million gallons of table wine to France over a four year period, delivered in tanker trucks and bottled in France. The French loved it. Eventually it came out that the product was simply a collection of chemicals mixed together and no grapes were used in the process. When Italy was taken to task the response was tough the French are supposed to be the connoisseurs.

Kudos to the Italian chemists who were able to make a synthetic wine. That's impressive.

For crying out loud Durgen get over yourself! Just because someone else comments or suggests something that doesn't line up exactly with your take on things, we don't need your comments on the matter. Just let it go. Sure you think wine's a scam. That's great. I don't like okra. I don't go on here talking about how okra is a con, and how everybody who eats it is a victim because they are an okra eating, myth swallowing, duty paying public. I just see the okra comments and let them go. That's how we do things here.

You don't like ice wine. Fine. You don't like wine. Fine. You think that wine is a waste of good grapes. Fine. However when you post those kinds of comments on here its not nessecary.

Its a friendly discussion forum. Why do you care if anybody makes wine with their grapes? You don't like wine. Fine. Go make your juice with your grapes and enjoy it. Make jelly with them. Put them on the compost pile, or feed it to the homeless. Whatever you choose to do with them is your right. However nobody else on here is going to say negative comments about your choices with your grapes or whatever your growing or doing with whatever you've produced. This is a friendly open forum to discuss all aspects of gardening not some place to post your idealistic views on everything that you disagree with. If that's the case go create your own forum and post up all those comments over there.

Keep that in mind or don't bother coming back. Either way the TEG will be a better place.

 

[Jared77]

To the original poster:

Id prune back anything unwanted, hopefully you can stay ahead of it and eventually it will die back or out completely. Tough to say though. I'd follow with what MontyJ suggested in his post on this thread. I think that might get you a good foundation for what your after. Then maybe expand into a variety that will do well in your area (I didn't see where your from sorry I couldn't be more help) and take what you learned with what you currently have and apply it to cultivating the new species.

Your local AG dept might be able to help you. I've also talked with people at the Farmers Markets to see what varieties they are growing and having success with. Never hurts to ask.

 

[journey11]

Hi Iona and

I make jelly out of wild grapes whenever I can get my hands on some. (My avatar is part of a pic of a jar of wild grape jelly...pretty color, huh!) They are really small and it takes a lot of them, but the flavor of those wild muscadines is really something out of this world. Hard to explain, just a deeper, richer flavor than your ordinary grapes. And yes, you can make wine out of them too. Just about anything you'd do with a regular grape, if you can get enough of them. The problem is that that they usually go so high up in the trees that you can't get to them. I look for trees that have fallen over and have brought them down to my reach.

They do go crazy and take over everything, so I agree with the others...you don't want them taking up residence near your tame grapes and competing for light and nutrients. This time of year is the best time of year to try to tackle that, while everything's dormant. Go in with pruners and a machete to get them out initially. Then keep it faithfully mowed down and eventually they'll give up and die. To get some for making jelly, you'll want to find another patch out in the woods somewhere. You really don't want them in your yard. Make some wreaths out of the ones you cut out.

For your tame grapes, a good book on how to care for them is Successful Berry Growing by Gene Logsdon. I think it's out of print now, but maybe you can find it at your library. It covers in depth grapes, blackberries, strawberries...and a bunch of other berries.

 

[MontyJ]

Thank you for all your replies and help! To answer some questions and give more info, our soil is a rocky clay that plants grow surprisingly well in. For a support (terrace?), I was planning on the traditional four corners with beams running in between. I don't remember the grape type, I'll check, but is there a grape that would thrive in our soil type? How about pruning? And my biggest concern with digging up the invasive thorns and grapes was damaging the intended grape's roots. Problem? And some general grape care info would be appreciated!

If you go with the typical four post and beam approach, you will quickly discover how much of a nightmare pruning can be. Grapes are often grown in that fashion, for shade. For production you need to support them as I described earlier, or in a similar way. I'll see if I can find some pics of my grapes to give you an idea of what I am describing.