Seed Rack, 2017

[digitS']

What are you saving?


Okay, they are on the tool rack behind the pickup seat . Sally and Amy Sue aren't at risk of being mixed into the other tomatoes in the house. There is beginning to be quite a few in the kitchen and utility room! Actually, being lost in the mix begins in the garden. If I can carry them in my shirt pockets, the tomatoes' identities are much safer than in a bucket with their neighbors.

Amy Sue is the pink on the right. That tomato is much smaller than the others on the plant but should have the same genetics. The Sally must be a rather extreme oblate shaped fruit. They are pretty much all this shape and certainly unlike their round fruited Bloody Butcher parent.

Saving seed?

Steve

 

[journey11]

I've started on tomato seeds and patiently await the beans, some of which I planted more so for seed than for eating. My, I am seeing a lot of bumblebees in the bean patch this year though. Didn't plant any sunflowers this year--big mistake! Going to try my hand at watermelon pollination this year too. And Okra will be an easy one.

 

[digitS']

Those bumblebees!

We are advised to save the seed that develops early. I wonder if that is because of the pollinators, out there - mixing things up. At first, I thought it was to select for earlier genetics, which makes sense. It has only been recently that it's occurred to me that cross-pollination problems may be the reason for the advice.

I kinda like cross-pollination "problems." Using fresh seed is better but I try to have some from earlier years. My thinking is that I can go back another year if newer seed is suspect. And, I don't need to save seed from a plant in the current garden unless, I want to .

My problem with saving first tomato fruits is that so often they are deformed. Early season stress must do that but how do I know that something won't be wrong with all the fruit? I just wait until they look good on a good looking plant.

I really should map the tomato patch. It would reduce anxiety because I can't get in and find plant labels without real effort. They are stuck in the ground too close to the plants.

Steve

 

[so lucky]

This looks like a good thread to report my experience with beans, bumble bees, hybrids, saving seeds, etc.
As you know, I saved seed from my Fortex pole beans. It is listed as a hybrid in some catalogs, OP in others.
Someone mentioned that bumble bees are some of the only pollinators that can pollinate bean flowers because they are heavy enough to pull down the lower petal to get to the pollen inside. That fact would seem to mean that beans are generally self pollinating and there wouldn't be a lot of crossing.
I have had a lot of bumble bees this year, I mean a lot. There must be a nest near here.
The Fortex beans are not Fortex-like. About 90% of them are shorter, lumpy and fibrous. The exact opposite of Fortex. Is there any way they could be crossing with soybeans, which are growing in the field next to them? Are they close genetically? I thought soybeans were actually peas of some sort.
There are about 10% that actually look like Fortex; long and pencil thin, no seeds showing. As luck would have it, these are the beans that the bugs seem to adore, so the chance of getting one of these without 5 or 6 bug bites is pretty small.

If the disappointing harvest this year is due to me trying to save 5 bucks by saving seed, I'll take that as a lesson and move on, but if it is due to bumble bees cross pollinating with God-knows-what kind of beans, what does that say for all the seed savers out there who are trying to keep specific seed from going extinct?
Sorry for the long post....I am just not too keen on gardening right now. But I need to figure out what to do for next year, if I even put in a garden.

 

[aftermidnight]

@so lucky I'm a seed saver, I grow beans, beans and more beans, in a small back yard garden. I really haven't had a problem with crossing so far but I usually bag several flowering stems just when they're starting to form, you can make your own bags or what I have done of late is buy wedding favor bags...


These can be reused over and over again, notice I have turned the top edge down on the white one so it's easier to snug it right in against the bean vine. The only thing is with these is to make sure you remove them once you see the beans starting to form. If forgotten the beans will curl up in a ball and they're hard to remove. When removing the bags I tie a piece of green garden tie tape around these ones so I know not to pick them.

Of course there are a few varieties of P. vulgaris that are notorious for crossing like Ma Williams, when growing these I try to give them as much isolation as possible usually out front, with this one I bag a lot of flowers and only keep these ones for seed, we eat the rest. The seed from the bagged flowers I grow are used only if or when I think I have a cross or if I have enough these are the ones I use in trades. So far the crosses that have occurred in my garden to date have been from seed I've gotten in trade.
One exception though, this variety 'Mr. Tung's' a bean that came to Canada over 100 years ago from China, it's a tender good tasting snap bean.


Years ago I had one bean in a pod that was a different color than the rest...

The brown ones are what the seed is supposed to look like, I planted this pink seed and got pods like this, totally different in size and shape...

.......................................................................Shelly and dried seed from these pods.

The next year I planted one of these and got this...

Big fat white seed with pink speckles and the pods were heavily marked in rosy red. Still have this seed somewhere but haven't grown it again to see what it would produce. By the way the pods were tough and fibrous, not worth eating.

Runners are notorious for crossing so I only grow one runner each year, my neighbor also grows a runner but she very kindly grows the same one I do each year, I supply her with seed, still I always bag one or two flowers as a safe guard as you can see in the above picture.

Annette

 

[so lucky]

That's a great idea, Annette. I bet catching the flower bud stem at the right stage is a little tricky. I need to be a little more observant.
I think you should continue to grow that sport on, to see if it continues to morph through the generations.
I wouldn't have been so aggravated if I were growing these for fun or curiosity, but these are my only crop of beans, for freezing green beans. I will be freezing a bunch today, but I am going to bet they won't be a "good freezing bean." I'll find that out in a few months.

 

[journey11]

Earlier yields would definitely be something to shoot for. I think you'd have less risk of disease contaminated seed too.

Using fresh seed is better but I try to have some from earlier years. My thinking is that I can go back another year if newer seed is suspect.

I keep some back too. A time or two, I've had things cross and needed to go back and start again.

I really should map the tomato patch. It would reduce anxiety because I can't get in and find plant labels without real effort. They are stuck in the ground too close to the plants.

Something eye-level would be wonderful, halfway up the bean pole or atop the tomato stake, if I can come up with something that won't fade in the sun. I keep a chart in my notebook of what was planted where and when. Plant tags get lost inevitably, but found when tilling next year.

That's a good idea, @aftermidnight , a sure bet! I've had good results distracting them with sunflowers, but plant a couple successions so they'll be sure to time out. I can't have too many sunflowers anyhow. I'll never neglect to plant them again or at least bag. I've never seen so many bumblebees out there before. And these are the big ones, not the little mason bees. The pole beans are hit hardest. I still have some in bloom and need to bag some for Russ's beans. I enjoy an occasional surprise, but not too many!

@so lucky , soy beans are a different species, but it's probably crossed with another P. vulgaris dry bean type. If you've planted a good size sampling, the majority of seed from this year's Fortex should come out just fine. Pull up any odd types and toss out as you note them. Beans still don't cross that easily. Any oddballs hiding among your crop of seed will be few.

 

[ninnymary]

Steve, I keep my plant tags a good 6 feet in front of the plant. So far, so good.

Mary

 

[Nyboy]

I once had a well meaning person go over my whole yard removing tags from trees and shrubs.

 

[Smart Red]

Well-meaning? Sounds like passive-agressive to me.