Government Takeover of Your Garden

sparkles2307

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hoodat said:
Skunks are also insectivores by nature (with a few grond nesting bird eggs and mice thrown in) If skunks are digging in your garden or flower bed it's a good bet you have cutworms or grubs.
They dig in our ditch, about 500 ft from the gardens. I've found cutworms in my potted plants and one or two in my garden, but they've not cause too many problems yet. We get a lot of skunks in the garage after our dog food....and in the barn after the baby chicks.
 

seedcorn

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Commercial agriculture isn't a system like nature. It is a factory. Well, and attempt to force factory practices on nature.
Ag is commercial, yes, we do try to make a living in AG only. Our gardens/pets are hobbies not designed to make our living.


The world has survived eons with non-GMO seed... why mess with it?
The world has survived eons w/out electricity, internet, computers, cars, why mess with them for they are polluting the world? In Ag it's because we've taken on the responsibility to feed people. Don't like GMO, pay extra for non-GMO crops, meat raised the way you want it, and don't compare prices vs. grocery stores or GMO crops. They can't compete. Most people I know sell their non-GMO below cost of production if they tried to pay for their labor, ground & facilities. Now pay your bills when you can't get paid for your labor. I know NONE of US would work for an employer without getting compensated. We can't raise non-GMO for the same costs as we can GMO, it's that simple.

I love my garden but if I tried to pay for my labor and all other expenses, it would be at a loss--I'll never admit that to my wife tho..............:D

I will now ship my skunks to you skunk lovers...........they eat my sweet corn, chickens, and stink up my shed. So I'll pass them on............
 

freemotion

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You do not need 20 acres to be self-sufficient. You need that much if you manage it like a modern factory farm. If you manage it by working with natural ecosystems, you can be very self-sufficient on much, much less land. How much? Depends on the size of your family and how much they eat!

The world would be a much healthier place without corn and soy. As much as I love corn, well, there would be far fewer lifestyle diseases (these diseases are caused by choices people make, and sadly, also caused by choices that parents make for their children) if it were not in about 90% of the items in any American grocery store.

Don't get me started on soy... :p
 

seedcorn

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I would love to know how to live (pay all living expenses) on 20 Acres--outside of growing pot. Now if you are talking garden, chickens, etc to supplement your town job, that is another subject. Been doing that for over 40 years.

Asians seem to be doing quite nicely on soy products. Considered a health food. I do support your decision to not use any and would defend you against anyone who would force you to use them
 

wifezilla

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Jared77

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As far as genetically altered crops they are dangerous. Once again they are trying to push things in areas that don't belong. Drought resistant crops to feed areas of people that are not meant to sustain life. Its that simple. Or by altering their production you can get more from less. So the cost per item goes down. Again at what long term cost? That remains to be seen.

I would love to know how to live (pay all living expenses) on 20 Acres--outside of growing pot.
Its not living all expenses paid. Its one thing to produce what you need so you don't have to buy it and saving money to invest in other things and living healthier. Thats different than trying to grow enough so that all your doing is living off what you produce.
 

freemotion

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In my area, a farmer absolutely could make a living on 20 acres. Not with monocropping, though. CSA, farmstand, keep pigs and chickens to eat the unsaleable stuff, keep bees, buy a few products from smaller producers for resale in the farmstand, etc. CSA shares sell out fast here. There is a farm nearby that sells organic garlic only, and they sell out their two products quickly, too....scapes and bulbs. There is a goat dairy that has a farm store and sells at farmer's markets. The farmer next to me sells xmas trees, pumpkins, squash, cornstalks, berries, etc on 20-30 acres. He is doing quite well and all three of his children are going to college and he has a nice retirement built up. A little further down the road on about 20-30 acres (much of it wooded and not in use) is a farm the sells nothing but started plants for two fast and furious months, May and June. Then they close for the rest of the year. From the condition and improvements in the property and business, I'd say they are doing quite well. In the time I've been buying from them (I also walk my dogs on the back of there property, I see what is going on with my own eyes) they've gone from one cash register to 8, always with long lines.

None of these farmers grow pot, to my knowledge. They all make a living with farming. There are many more within a 10-minute drive from my house...I shop at their stands all summer and fall. They all have nicer houses than I do and drive nicer cars. I have a "town job" that is fairly high paying, although part-time. I should switch to farming!
 

wifezilla

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In my area, a farmer absolutely could make a living on 20 acres. Not with monocropping, though
BINGO! You cannot use 20 acres and try to be a mini factory farm. It wont work. You can, however, use polyculture, taking advantage of nature instead of fighting tooth and nail against it.

I know if I had more space I could get my ducks to be self-sustaining. I MIGHT even get to that point in my little yard. With my pond system, I don't even have to feed the fish! Nature provides free bugs and other insect larvae. The fish turn that in to more fish and the ducks benefit. If I just packed my yard with ducks I would be brining in bag after bag of feed and then worrying about what to do with all the poop.

As it is now every scrap of poopy bedding gets aged and composted and goes on the garden beds.

If all I tried to do was gardening and I didn't have the ducks and their compost, I would have to be bringing in bags of fertilizer.

The key is to find an integrated system that works with your climate, your animals, and zone appropriate crops. How do they feed on or help each other?

If you only want to grow one thing and not incorporate anything else, you are going to struggle, you are going to be at the mercy of large corporations like Monsanto and you are going to be at the mercy of rising energy prices for your chemical fertilizers and pesticides.
 

Jared77

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The key is to find an integrated system that works with your climate, your animals, and zone appropriate crops. How do they feed on or help each other?
I agree but to what end though? If your able to provide for your own needs, is it worth expanding if you take everything up in scale? Is the time, effort, and materials worth the end result? That's my question. Taking the self sustaining model and expanding it with the intention of turning a profit.

For example if you kept enough dual purpose poultry to keep yourself in meat and eggs, is it worth raising extra chicks and housing extra hens
to sell eggs and meat? Is it worth expanding the garden to plant more veggies or make canned items to sell at the farmers market?

I'm not talking about getting extras for example more eggs than you can eat, or your tomatoes really take off and you've got more than you can eat. But intentionally working towards sells is what I'm getting at.

I guess I'm trying to see where the line is regarding the end result/product being worth the extra investment of time, resources etc.
 

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