"How Much Is That Doggy In The Window ...

[ducks4you]

Honestly, I see no need for purebred dog breeding. ALL of these breeders have produced dogs with genetic health problems. Anybody who breeds these compromised dogs even outcrossing, puts their health genetics and problems into the dog population. Our associate attorney lost her 4yo White Highland Terrior who was riddled with stones in her liver. She suffered for a week before being euthanised. My friend's family is devistated.
I met someone in the 1980s with a 1yo purebred LAB with his dysplasia who cried every time they took her on a walk. Damaltians who are blind or deaf. GS's with heart murmers. King Chales Spaniels who have brains growing out of their skulls. It sounds like a horror film, but it is common practice today. Please stop this purebred breeding!
I won't get a purebred dog. Period. ALL of my dogs are mixes and all of them waited to get sick from old dog illnesses when they were old dogs.
People who breed refuse to outcross anymore, which was what kept these breeds healthy enough for use. Ask breeders what they do with returned sick puppies. They put them down. There are waaayyyy too many dogs without homes, yet these people have decided that they are doing us all good putting sick animals up for sale. They ALL have dollar signs in their eyes and refuse to see how they make animals suffer.
Spay and neuter, spay and neuter, spay and neuter and don't encourage people to breed animals who will suffer.

 

[ducks4you]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/02/12/purebred-dogs-health-risks_n_4771566.html
http://www.examiner.com/article/designed-to-suffer-purebred-dogs-are-plagued-with-health-problems
I own dogs, chickens and horses. I am on a horse forum and we talk about HTTP which is a genetic disorder that occurs in horses descended from the QH Stallion, "Impressive." This was caused by deliberate inbreeding, breeding sire to daughter, son to dam, and their descendants to each other. The horses have seizures and die painful deaths. Perhaps bc horses are utilitarian, that is, we choose to own and ride or drive them, that the horse industry suffers from fewer genetic inbred health problems, but this is just one example and they do exists in other breeds as well. Horseman often cross between breeds and many horse breeds accept and register animals that are outcrossed.
The Thoroughbred industry does not do this. TB's have bad backs, poor legs, tissue paper hooves and many are raced into their ground and don't live to see their 10th b'day. Remember the filly, "Ruffian"?
http://www.tbgreats.com/ruffian/
She didn't live to see her 4th b'day. Her leg snapped in a race from poor build and directly related to inbred genetics.
When you have a problem that can be fixed by stopping bad behavior, like smoking, why do you choose to defend the bad behavior?

 

[Smart Red]

I realize that there are problems when people get into breeding animals. However, I question the use of the word ALL as in "I see no need for purebred dog breeding. ALL of these breeders have produced dogs with genetic health problems.

There certainly are people, way too many people, who think they can breed their purebred dog for some easy, extra money. But there are plenty of breeders interested in the best quality of purebred standard that they can reach. Gotta go make lunch. . . .

 

[ducks4you]

No, they are not. After 150 years of INTENSE purebred dog breeding, purebreds are unhealthy, just like cheetahs, with low gene pools. If you really researched this, you would find out that these breeders never get a single entire group of puppies that are normal and healthy. When they get unhealthy puppies, they put those down and they just keep breeding. I'm not a European apologist, but in some places in Europe their dogs, like GS in Germany, have to be healthy specimens in order to be certified as breeding animals. Otherwise, their puppies don't get certified, which is like our registration. Many US GS's are crippled today, literally, and cannot gait correctly.
http://www.angesgardiens.ca/ANG/Health.htm
When I was young, I never heard of dogs that had all of these problems. Theses genetic problems have made their way through all of the genetics. When someone tells you, Weeelllllll, a mutt can have these problems, too. Well, yeah, bc that dog was the result of a parent who had genetic problems from inbreeding in the past. I am a BIG animal lover and I just hate it when pride gets in the way of common sense. If we want to have more healthy dogs, people should stop breeding. The occasional accidental litters should persuade people to take their female dog to the Vet ASAP, so that she only has ONE accidental litter. GS's for example have an average litter of 12 puppies. My two mixed breed female dogs are 1/4 GS. I have calculated the number of possible puppies that each could have had in their 8 years and come to: 340. They could have had 4 big litters each year, and that's 48/year. Think it's not possible? You haven't been in contact with these breeders who wear out their dogs in an effort to make money each year. I had my dogs fixed at 6 months and neither have had any puppies.
I STILL run across people who could easily spay or neuter their suburban dogs and say, "Oh...I might breed him/her someday." I think that they need a weekend of pictures of unwanted, suffering dogs to see how they add to the problem.
Dog are wonderful creatures, so trainable, and no other animal is as loyal as your dog. My friend's terrier was an affectionate dog. SHE had to suffer bc her breeder just wanted to make a buck. despicable

 

[thistlebloom]

I think it's been pointed out by a few people on this forum that even mutts have their share of genetic deficiencies, if that's the proper term.

There certainly are many purebred breeders with integrity, so it's not possible that they all are contributing to the problems of over population and health issues.

I have had purebreds and I have had mutts, and there hasn't been any real discernible difference in their longevity. They've all lived longer than the standard for their breed, or mix of breeds and lived that long without diseases. But personal anecdotes aren't the basis for a general truth.


I also want to say that I love my dogs, and take good care of them. But in the end they are dogs, not a child substitute, and not the source of all my happiness. When they die I'm sad and miss them, but I would never be devastated by it.

 

[seedcorn]

@ducks4you, understand your points. As a son of a former purebred breeder (Brittney Spaniels used for hunting), they did things that NO mutt could ever do. We had many hunters try to prove us wrong. Most of those dogs we would have left in the field as next year's organic matter.

My wife owns a mutt (cross between a mutt and another mutt) he has MORE allergies than any pure bred I've ever been around.

They breed for a reason, don't like the reason, don't buy them. Even have the right to get legislation against it. & they have right to fight against it. America, gotta love it.

Any person who makes an animal do what is causing obvious pain, may the same happen to them. I have no problem putting down an in pain animal.

 

[Nyboy]

Like every thing else in life you have the good and the bad. It is the buyer who needs to research what kind of breeder they are going to. My teenage years I worked as a tech for a vet in Bronx. Clients did not have much money, very few had purebreds. Mix breeds get all the same illness. I am sorry about your friends dog, mixed dogs also can get stones at a early age. Having a boarding and grooming kennel i get to see my puppies their whole life. Now as i speak i have a dog i bred who is 13 years old boarding with me. Your statement " Breeders never get a single entire group of puppies that are normal and healthy" is just so far from true. Almost every litter I bred had all healthy puppies, which I follow for their life. Like I said there are good and bad do your reseach before buying. People have whats called breed loyaly, they only want that breed. Any puppy I sell is not taking a home away from a shelter dog, because my client only want my breed. Golden and poodle people I find would never have any other type of dog. There is nothing wrong with wanting a certain look or size in a dog.

 

[majorcatfish]

back when i use to duck hurt my pure breed black lab j.j. was treated as a family member and as well as an extension to my hunting. that dog could be sound a sleep and you could close the breach on the shotgun, he was up and wanting to retrieve.
now since i do not hunt all my dogs have been either come from shelters or a stray. if you are not going to have a dog to be a job specific animal
pound puppies are the way to go..

 

[TheSeedObsesser]

I agree that both pure-bred and mixed dogs can have similar health problems, brought on by genetics. That's from so many generations of these dogs being bred by irresponsible breeders. If we would've been playing the game nature's way, and either culling or breeding the unhealthy individuals, I think that we had have much less health problems in our dogs and dog breeds. There should be some kind of regulations or laws when it comes to breeding dogs, but something like that would be very hard to enforce.

I think that I understand ducks4u's points, and partly agree if not for a slightly different reason. I think that dog breeds that have very small populations in the U.S. should probably be cross-bred to avoid inbreeding problems (breeds that come to mind might be Mudi or Peruvian Inca Orchid). Maybe breed a dog to a member of a different breed and breed the offspring to the original breed. But this is how I would handle things. It's really up to the individual dog breeders to make that choice, even the irresponsible ones.

I also strongly agree with seedcorn that people breed those dogs for a reason, and if you don't like that reason then don't buy them. It's like voting with your dollar.

 

[thistlebloom]

Where do all those shelter dogs come from?

If we only buy shelter dogs doesn't that just reinforce the irresponsible peoples position? Then what would we eventually end up with?

It's just not in the realm of reality that all of those millions of unwanted dogs are going to get a home, even if purebred breeders stopped today and the only way you could get a dog was through a shelter. So now we have "no kill" shelters that warehouse unadoptable dogs for their lifetime.

I don't think the answer is yet another law.