The Seed Emergency: The Threat to Food and Democracy

[hoodat]

Though I am concerned about cancer and don't want the food I eat to contribute more to my risks, I am more concerned about Monsantos affect on the small time farmer. It seems to me just another way to make the poor poorer and the rich richer. It's a monopoly, it's criminal, and they need to be stopped for that reason alone.

Nice thought but what is killing the small farmer in the midwest is the profit margins per acre won't support a small operation when you factor in land prices (just watched 200+ acres bring $11,000/acre for farm ground), equipment costs (new combine =$500,000+), health insurance rising, land taxes for schools rising, etc. Takes a certain amount of volume that has nothing to do with Ag businesses on the seed side. Actually seed is the best value they make--I am prejudiced tho..............

Monsanto is not even close to a monopoly in the seed business as far as the crop seeds.

I do hear you on food safety, which is why I refuse to participate in slave labor ag.

The percentages vary with the investigator since Monsanto will not release the figures on what percentage of crop seeds thay sell but most agree it is over 80% of all soybean seeds and around the same percentage of corn seed. Most people don't realize that Monsanto really isn't making their profits mainly on the seed but on the Roundup which is an inherent part of the system. Once the ground is saturated with Roundup only Monsanto seeds with the Roundup resistant gene will grow there for several years.
Here is about as balanced an article as I could find pointing out both the advantages and dangers of Monsanto methods.http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/11/28/AR2009112802471.html?wprss=rss_print

 

[seedcorn]

most agree it is over 80% of all soybean seeds and around the same percentage of corn seed.

Not even close. Dupont sells 30%, Monsanto-32%, Syngenta-7%, Agreliant-7%, Dow-5%, 1%-Stine, independents that buy seed from Dupont/Syngenta-10%, rest are a bunch of independents that sell what ever they can buy on wholesale market cheap.

On soybean seed it's broke up between Dupont, Monsanto, Syngenta, Dow, Stine, and a few smaller companies. While it's true that most of the soybeans are glysophate resistent the trait fees are non-existant for Dupont and Syngenta. They paid an upfront fee to Monsanto to help pay for the RR research.

Glysophate is a contact killer, not a ground sterilant. All chemicals eventually lose their effectiveness due to a whole host of reasons. People not in agriculture do not understand the different decisions we are forced to make--mainly because people want food raised in volume as cheaply as it can be done. Where Monsanto makes their money on glysophate is selling it to the home consumer in the diluted form, not in agriculture.

 

[hoodat]

Once again there are no exact figures for how long it takes glysophosphate to break down in the soil; there are too many variables but even the most conservative estimates carry it into the next growing cycle. Organic farmers that have tried to farm formerly GMO cropland say that no organic crops can be grown for from 3 to 5 years after the last Roundup is applied but that may be due to Roundup killing off the soil life. Soil has to be alive with the proper soil organisms before it can be farmed organically. It takes that long for those organisms to repopulate. It may be my own prejudice but I cannot believe that dead soil can produce food that is healthy.
There is a disconnect between what Roundup is intended to do and what it actually does. No one can convince me that any product can completely wipe out one life form and have no effect at all on the others. All life is too closely connected to believe that.

 

[thistlebloom]

Where Monsanto makes their money on glysophate is selling it to the home consumer in the diluted form, not in agriculture.

This is from Wikipedia. Not the best reference, I know, so take it for what it's worth

' The EPA estimates that in the US during 2007, the agricultural market used 180 to 185 million pounds (82,000 to 84,000 tonnes) of glyphosate, the home and garden market used 5 to 8 million pounds (2,300 to 3,600 tonnes), and industry, commerce and government used 13 to 15 million pounds (5,900 to 6,800 tonnes), according to its Pesticide Industry Sales & Usage Report for 2006-2007 published in February, 2011 '

 

[Ladyhawke1]

Where Monsanto makes their money on glysophate is selling it to the home consumer in the diluted form, not in agriculture.

This is from Wikipedia. Not the best reference, I know, so take it for what it's worth

' The EPA estimates that in the US during 2007, the agricultural market used 180 to 185 million pounds (82,000 to 84,000 tonnes) of glyphosate, the home and garden market used 5 to 8 million pounds (2,300 to 3,600 tonnes), and industry, commerce and government used 13 to 15 million pounds (5,900 to 6,800 tonnes), according to its Pesticide Industry Sales & Usage Report for 2006-2007 published in February, 2011 '

I agree with you about Wikipedia . Caution is needed. Thom Hartmann http://www.thomhartmann.com/ has found out that the right-wing is working as fast as they can to erase and in some instances replace information on certain subjects. Remember information is power and THEY do not want us to have the information.

It pays to know who, and what has happened in the past, and who has the accredited and documented scientific data not related to industry , and not paid for by the industry.

It is said, To not know what happened before you were born, is to forever be a child.

 

[seedcorn]

Where Monsanto makes their money on glysophate is selling it to the home consumer in the diluted form, not in agriculture.

This is from Wikipedia. Not the best reference, I know, so take it for what it's worth

' The EPA estimates that in the US during 2007, the agricultural market used 180 to 185 million pounds (82,000 to 84,000 tonnes) of glyphosate, the home and garden market used 5 to 8 million pounds (2,300 to 3,600 tonnes), and industry, commerce and government used 13 to 15 million pounds (5,900 to 6,800 tonnes), according to its Pesticide Industry Sales & Usage Report for 2006-2007 published in February, 2011 '

I would not disagree with the amounts it's just that very little of the glysophate is Monsanto glysophate (trade name Round-up). Most of it is generic. Plus the margins in Ag are very small. A gallon of generic glysophate has sold for as little to the farmer (not middle man but the farmer) for $8/gallon. Go into Walmart and price it sold in those nifty spray bottles. A gallon of Glysophate diluted will make about 50-100 gallons of end product. More profit made selling it to the home user.

Sorry I should have been more clear.

 

[Detlor Poultry]

Where Monsanto makes their money on glysophate is selling it to the home consumer in the diluted form, not in agriculture.

This is from Wikipedia. Not the best reference, I know, so take it for what it's worth

' The EPA estimates that in the US during 2007, the agricultural market used 180 to 185 million pounds (82,000 to 84,000 tonnes) of glyphosate, the home and garden market used 5 to 8 million pounds (2,300 to 3,600 tonnes), and industry, commerce and government used 13 to 15 million pounds (5,900 to 6,800 tonnes), according to its Pesticide Industry Sales & Usage Report for 2006-2007 published in February, 2011 '

I have to bow out of this conversation since I don't know anything about Glycosophate, but I do know that wikipedia can be unreliable....
Over the years, I've kept a list of really stupid and incorrect things I've found on wiki, but most of them have been corrected.

 

[thistlebloom]

Where Monsanto makes their money on glysophate is selling it to the home consumer in the diluted form, not in agriculture.

This is from Wikipedia. Not the best reference, I know, so take it for what it's worth

' The EPA estimates that in the US during 2007, the agricultural market used 180 to 185 million pounds (82,000 to 84,000 tonnes) of glyphosate, the home and garden market used 5 to 8 million pounds (2,300 to 3,600 tonnes), and industry, commerce and government used 13 to 15 million pounds (5,900 to 6,800 tonnes), according to its Pesticide Industry Sales & Usage Report for 2006-2007 published in February, 2011 '

I would not disagree with the amounts it's just that very little of the glysophate is Monsanto glysophate (trade name Round-up). Most of it is generic. Plus the margins in Ag are very small. A gallon of generic glysophate has sold for as little to the farmer (not middle man but the farmer) for $8/gallon. Go into Walmart and price it sold in those nifty spray bottles. A gallon of Glysophate diluted will make about 50-100 gallons of end product. More profit made selling it to the home user.

Sorry I should have been more clear.

No problem Seedcorn. I'm not looking for an argument, just happened to stumble on that info while looking up other information.

Ladyhawk: Right wing?? Really? I'm not going to get dragged into a debate with you, but your agenda is crystal clear. And now I'm done with this subject.

 

[seedcorn]

Hoodat, organic in Indiana is 3 year waiting period after glysophate is used. Seven if you use any other chemical. The reason is that all other chemical have 1/2 lives while glysophate has a very short half life. Once it hits the ground, the microbes in the soil deactivate it. Can it be detected w/chemical test, yes but it's in a different chemical form from active chemical--think fossil.

Organic gardening on non-organic soil takes a while for the green manure to build up tilth again to be able to produce without using fertilizers. While not a big fan of GMO's, one of the great side benefits has been the rise of earthworm populations in our fields because we've quit using insecticides to kill the rootworm, corn borer larvae. Plus the farmers don't have to handle insecticides, don't have open bags for anything to get into, etc. the glysophate gene has allowed the farmer to use about 1/2 of the chemicals on corn and about 1/10 of the chemicals we did on soybeans 10 years ago. The days of producing enough grain to feed the world without the use of modern technology has long passed. You either feed them or fight them, we chose to feed them. Now if we could get certain people to stop reproducing at unrealistic rates. But that is another subject.

 

[thistlebloom]

I don't mean to be a pain in the rear, but the word is glyphosate, not glysophate.

Okay, I am a pain in the rear.